National race lengths

[Mazda Jon]

At this past weekends Double Rational at PPIR we were given a printed time specific schedule. I found it interesting that the race lengths were "30 minutes or 35 laps." The track length is 1.3 miles and our group would never get close to the 35 laps in 30 minutes. The fast EP car qualified at 1:03.

It was asked in the Saturday morning drivers meeting with a simple "yes, that is correct."

I looked in the GCR and found the following;

C. National races must be scheduled for a number of laps equaling at
least 45 miles. The SOM may reschedule all or any of the races to
30 minutes if conditions warrant.

The other great thing was the printed schedule was dated for Saturday and Sunday, but they shortened the practice and qualifying on Sunday. I was scheduled to go out for practice at 0900 by the schedule and I walked out of the trailer at 0830 and saw my group on track. That was a great surprise and I missed the session. I was not pleased.

I was wondering if anyone else runs into the "prescheduled" shortened races. We only had around 80-90 cars total in 5 groups.

 

[Bobby Lentz]

I have never seen that. Seems in violation of the GCR. Maybe to accommodate the regional guys whose cell's aren't big enough for national races.

 

[Matt Blehm]

Same type of deal here.
Last weekend at TWS, they shortened the races from 35 min to 30 min "because of the heat". It was over 100 in the afternoon both days, and many drivers were in rough shape after coming off the track. I personally wasn't too bad, but I'm relatively young and spend a lot of time working outside in the heat. I know a lot of others that don't.

As for the minutes OR laps deal, the way I understood it is the laps are based on how many laps the fastest groups (GT1 or FA/FB/FC) *should* run a 30 min race. So that one is the only one that's really lap-counted. the rest are essentially going to be timed due to the slower laps. Something like that is what I was told at one time or another.

As for the scheduling, I hear you on how it was run. We had a race like that a few months ago and didn't like it too well. the "practice" on Sat was like 5-8 min per group- enough for about 3 laps. It was freakin cold and nobody from group 1 (FF/FV) went out to keep from freezing. since nobody from group 1 went out, group 2 didn't know when to show up to grid since they were watching the track. by the time group 4 rolled around, we had a lot of mad drivers standing around grid in various cars.

I was working grid and could only do what the stewards said as far as who to let out.. I brought it up to them and the simple point was "the drivers know what run order they're in and if they see the group before them on track, they should be smart enough to get to grid."
But when you're running an 8 min practice session, that's a bit rough..

they didn't even run the practice on Sunday and just ran qual/race only. not sure what was up with it, but that weekend was a circus.

 

[Terry Hanushek]

Jon

At this past weekends Double Rational at PPIR we were given a printed time specific schedule. I found it interesting that the race lengths were "30 minutes or 35 laps." The track length is 1.3 miles and our group would never get close to the 35 laps in 30 minutes. The fast EP car qualified at 1:03.

GCR 3.1.1.C. National races must be scheduled for a number of laps equaling at
least 45 miles. The SOM may reschedule all or any of the races to
30 minutes if conditions warrant.

IMO The race length (45 miles) is primary definition for a National race. If a secondary time parameter is added, it must be greater than the time that it takes the fastest class in the race to travel the 45 mile race length. Several years ago when I involved with approving NEDiv race supps, National races had to be specified in laps only per SCCA Club Racing; this GCR rule has not changed in that past 20 years. The secondary time specification (..or xx minutes) is sometimes added to the schedule / supps by a region to 'protect' against unexpected delays like weather or extensive cleanups. Again IMO, I feel that the a secondary time specification is unnecessary since the operating stewards have tools to address specific situtations.

That said, I believe that your PPIR supps violated the GCR abd should never have been approved in that form. It would have been interesting to see what would have resulted from a protest.

The other great thing was the printed schedule was dated for Saturday and Sunday, but they shortened the practice and qualifying on Sunday. I was scheduled to go out for practice at 0900 by the schedule and I walked out of the trailer at 0830 and saw my group on track. That was a great surprise and I missed the session. I was not pleased.

A basic rule of race organizing / stewarding is that you never move a session earlier without notifying ALL affected competitors (revised schedule highlighting changes in drivers packet, etc.). I can't comment on this specific incident because I wasn't there and have no idea how the decision was made or how it was communicated to competitors. In my experience, a change of this nature must be approved by the SOM and part of that approval process should have been a plan to notify all impacted competitors.

YMMV

See ya at te races

Terry

 

[James Rogerson]

Supplement regulations are conditions other than those spelled out in the GCR. They are reviewed by the Executive Steward of the division and the National Office prior to approval by the CRB or their representative. So anything in them is actually in accordance with the GCR.

Time certain races are normally mandated by TV and are almost impossible to follow in club racing. For instance if you are supposed to go out between 10:30 and 11:00 but the previous session clean up ran over to 11:05 then you would not get your session and would be escorted off grid and let the 11:00 to 11:30 group out on track. Time certain means just that, you get track time during your period and no other time is allowed.

Most club racing is done during a running time frame and every group just follows the other. Sounds like someone got confused and tried to be "fair", which is not legal if time certain is the format. That's why in pro racing the wrecks are shoved off to the side and left so the TV schedule can be kept.

Almost all time/group decisions are made to accommodate the majority of the entrants and workers.

Matt's example of the past weekend TWS event is a good one. The SOM shortened the races but left the Q/P times at 30 minutes. I'm twice his age and ran in two race groups with only an 8 lb loss in body weight.

James Rogerson
HP 66